Equinox and the current alliance?

Hello there!

As we have risen like phoenix from the ashes now and have the numbers to make an impact on the battlefield, what should we do about the other guilds in the alliance?

Whitescars is dead and their leader does not seem to have any intent to fix it.
Same goes for santa, almost at least. I have not heard a single word about any plans to fix their situation.
Enclave, they have a bunch of good players but does not seem to make a lot of effort to get back up on their feet. Might be that i just dont see it, but most of the day the Equinox stands for 85% of the total alliance roster.
As it is right now most guilds in the alliance is just a nice bunch of flags on the alliance page. Except for enclave which have a small number of good players online a few times per week.

What is your opinion about this?

Do you think we should votekick some guilds or leave the alliance? Stay and wait? Put more demands on the leaders of the other guilds? Or do you have any other ideas?

i believe carving our own way would definitely be beneficial.

BUT, what we need to solidify, is guild warbands. too many guildies staying in pugs rather than coming into the guild warband. we need more coordination.

vent being mandatory is a great things, but i can understand sometimes people are at work and can't use it, and those cases are acceptable. but for the most part it's a must.

Bruglir wrote:

i believe carving our own way would definitely be beneficial.

BUT, what we need to solidify, is guild warbands. too many guildies staying in pugs rather than coming into the guild warband. we need more coordination.

vent being mandatory is a great things, but i can understand sometimes people are at work and can't use it, and those cases are acceptable. but for the most part it's a must.

ofc its understandable a few cant come on vent. But it should be enforced.
The guild/alliance has no rule that vent is mandatory. It is up to the warband leader to decide.

If equinox started alliance kick rest because name is cool if not, leave and try make our own out there, maybe as we progress try get rump from guilds that left WAR be it pvp guilds but also pve masters

Angeli wrote:

If equinox started alliance kick rest because name is cool if not, leave and try make our own out there, maybe as we progress try get rump from guilds that left WAR be it pvp guilds but also pve masters

Maybe we should just go alone?
Instead on relying on other guilds in an alliance we can do whatever we want.
sure....we will loose a few good players in the alliance.....but hey...just recruit. Welcome new ppl into the guild and we can be start relying on ourselves only.
Then we have noone else to blame for our situation. end of the day its you as a members that create your own situation in the guild you are in.

I think the other guilds should say their opinion before anything is decided. This mostly goes for Enclave as the others are not very active at all. Personally I'd hate to not see some Enclave members in the alliance chat anymore...
Also we should check with those few active santa members if they want to come with us instead since they more or less always come for our guild/alliance warbands. At least to let them know they are very welcome to stay with us and if they want to go back to santa if they become more active. Should apply for any guild after consulting their leaders.

I agree with James that the alliance name rocks, so we could always keep it if others allow us to.
If not allied with any other guild we could make an alt guild to have in the alliance or something. That way we would be able to claim more keeps etc as well... and more guild vault space, which is needed. Hehe. In either way it would be full of us.

One more thing... If people will leave for Aion we will lose more people too and I wonder how the situation will be then... If many of our key members and leaders will leave things will fall just like the other guilds, I fear... So we need a stable ground before betting too high or becoming too confident... Or a lot of members will be let down and people wander their own ways.

yup i agree with u both , gona stay with war year maybe longer so i wouldnt like many more changes that i had in a year playing already

the way i see it, our alliance members don't have enough players online to do anything but PUG. we have enough to field at least 2 FG of players, often a warband.

we can be a massive impact on the game, but right now we're lacking because we don't have coordination. that's down to the guild members!

you don't have to be a hardcore player to understand the benefits of playing in a guild group, to know you can rely on them and them on you. there's a level of codependance you get in premade groups that pugs will never have. a pug can have the "perfect" setup, of healers, tanks, dps etc. but no matter how good that pug is, it will NEVER be as good as a guild group.

vent should be enforced, but players can't be punished for not using it. though, if they aren't able to synergise with the group, then they are a liability. for a player to not be on vent, but still perform to the right standard, they have to be exceptionally good. there are a few who can, but not all. even being on vent just to listen makes a huge difference. speaking is faster than typing, and you can do it while using your skills. in order to type you have to stop moving/attacking/healing.

my vote goes for Equinox breaking off from the alliance, we don't need them, they need us.

edit: of course, we should offer those guilds to merge with us too.

I would recomend speaking to the other guilds before you do anything.

Remember they stuck with us when we were going through a bad patch and at the moment Enclave is going through one with a lot of ppl leaving the game. Enclave is our oldest ally from the last server and it would be a shame to lose them. As for the other guilds, talk to them and give them a chance to rebuild if that is their wish.

We are a casual guild and trying to make ppl do anything which is considered hardcore will make them leave, in the case of vent, it is a bonus i agree but its not essential.
Using vent does'nt mean you have to speak on it, just using it to listen is fine.

The name of the alliance took us hours to come up with. Shad would'nt let any of the guild leaders or officers present leave until we had one
(Btw, Control Alt Delete is not the original alliance name)

Many enclave players stoped playing WAR, what left that i see online: Azgard, Massa, Spanky and Rahelia new Quickfinger[he lead almost all sieges and war effort for 2months? leader of legio] wanabe leading zerg to victory in this case to geting farmed most times.

Its told every time that peps dont need to speak on vent only listen[i'm doing that]

And when we were in good inst where only 2:1 could beat us, we left inst so we can join ALL one as alliance wb, but next day 1/3 choose to go with pug instead to work together o.O

I must say its nice to see peoples true colors come out I remember equinox going through a rough patch and enclave still supporting them and giving them time.
Now its enclave's turn to go through a rough patch and what happens "bye bye equinox" well if that's the case then I just have this to say to all of you:

bye bye and good riddance

It seems Equinox has changed a lot since i went away and it now looks like the hardcore element are running or should i say ruining? the guild. If this is the case then you are'nt making many friends by what you are posting and i can understand why some of the longest serving members are quittting the guild/game or just stopped playing as the casual and fun attitude has been replaced by ppl taking the game far too seriously.
As Massa said, they stood by us through the bad times and helped whenever they could and we should be returning the favour. I can't believe you are even considering kicking guilds from the alliance without talking to them. As a certain hypocrit said on another post that the summer means less ppl playing and we should wait out, but now changes his mind...

I don't know if the damage you have caused can be repaired or if you can be even bothered trying, but i think most of you have got your wishes now.
I think Shad wont be too happy finding that you have destroyed the alliance he and others worked hard to make, and insulted some of his oldest friends in the game in the process.

Having reread this post i can't believe how arrogant some of you are and tbh if you are like that ingame then maybe its not worth me coming back.

Well all i can say is congratulations to alienating the guild and making yourselves look like a bunch of arseholes.

Wheren't that long in equinox but quite long in alliance, and certainly didnt want to insult anyone from old members of envclave but the fact is that they play with pug when we have very strong players and with more interest from both sides we can partly fill the gap left by legio and bloodline.

We have dayly peps for 2full partys and few evenings in week full warband ! trouble or not we try to invite all alliance members to join and help.

For me we can wait and wait but last 2 weeks after Kharney left, things got worst someone should take lead there

Massa wrote:

I must say its nice to see peoples true colors come out I remember equinox going through a rough patch and enclave still supporting them and giving them time.
Now its enclave's turn to go through a rough patch and what happens "bye bye equinox" well if that's the case then I just have this to say to all of you:

bye bye and good riddance

Don't take it that way massa. :/ If you read the original post again I'm confident you can see that i adressed the problems from all possible angles.
I think the very reasons those things to surface is that no leader/leaders has come forward and said, okay, we have problems. Now, lets fix them.
Just to step forward and show your willpower as a leader has a major impact on the people around you.
I know spanky has willpower but yet I have not been summoned into any meeting or equal to discuss a situation that has been going on for ALL the guilds in the game lately. Both legio and bloodline are falling apart.

Xeme wrote:

It seems Equinox has changed a lot since i went away and it now looks like the hardcore element are running or should i say ruining? the guild. If this is the case then you are'nt making many friends by what you are posting and i can understand why some of the longest serving members are quittting the guild/game or just stopped playing as the casual and fun attitude has been replaced by ppl taking the game far too seriously.
As Massa said, they stood by us through the bad times and helped whenever they could and we should be returning the favour. I can't believe you are even considering kicking guilds from the alliance without talking to them. As a certain hypocrit said on another post that the summer means less ppl playing and we should wait out, but now changes his mind...

I don't know if the damage you have caused can be repaired or if you can be even bothered trying, but i think most of you have got your wishes now.
I think Shad wont be too happy finding that you have destroyed the alliance he and others worked hard to make, and insulted some of his oldest friends in the game in the process.

Having reread this post i can't believe how arrogant some of you are and tbh if you are like that ingame then maybe its not worth me coming back.

Well all i can say is congratulations to alienating the guild and making yourselves look like a bunch of arseholes.

Xeme, I feel it VERY unfair of you to say that I, or any other officer in the guild is ruining it.
The actions we have taken lately have been absolutely neccesary for the survival of the guild.
And! It has proven to work. We are now becoming stronger/bigger again and have a biiiig chat room full of a nice atmosphere all the time.
We can have 25-30 ppl online sometimes, while other guilds, recently had the same numbers, are down to 5-10. Legio and bloodline for example.
I have even seen bloodline ppl shout in region chat for help with be/bb and LV :/
Sad thing to see 2 big guilds like that fall into the history books. No matter their attitude, they were big and they pushed the game.
Remember, 4 weeks ago we had 5-7 members online prime time.
We salvaged a serious situation that ALL the guilds in war had. Remember that.

I dont mean to sound like a prick or anything, but I think you need to be in the game and experience what is going on before you can make posts like that.
If it is any good to you I can leave to Aion, pronto, and you can see what happenes to the guild. I've just had enough talk of, -oh, chris is going to be so mad when he hears about this....as soon as ppl dont understand a decision or are unhappy with anything.
Can't you people start to see that the officers are working their ASSES off to keep this boat floating. And that we are doing it by ANY means neccesary.
To have an atmosphere where people will STAY rather than quit the game and cancel thir sub.
If it was JUST as simple as an atmosphere problem we can all cancel our sub and go chat on MSN instead. But now we have two things pulling. Progress vs laid back coffee break with the aunts.
Everyone reading this, at least try to save us the trouble of questioning our motives and try to wrap your brains around what i just said.
In hard times like this you dont have a lot of patience with obstacles. You have enough of them already.

Hmmm, seems things are getting worse than they should be...
In my eyes the main problem is the morale in general... Some people work to keep others up and when things don't pay off in any way it becomes quite draining... For example if people don't show up for certain things, when one tries to organize fun for alliance and people prefer leading/join pugs. Still no reason to overreact etc.

It is true that Equinox are strong at the moment, but not that strong... Imo we can't afford to lose any members, so be it alliance or guild members... Simply because a lot of things are resting on a very thin thread, including leaders/officers. Best possible solution would be to become one if possible.
Also I can't really see the point in doing this in a hostile way or with any hard feelings... And personally I don't want to lose Enclave. Why? Because Enclave were here long before me and I have nothing to say about it. The respect for the old members that I got to know in Enclave will remain and nothing should be done without consulting them first. No reason to get enemies for nothing.

So we have the greater numbers online, that doesn't make us any better as persons and saying we don't need them or whatever is quite disrespectful, cause after all we are mere players behind our monitors and we all want to have fun... Why close people out of that only because they can't pull good enough numbers etc? Their morale may be low as well and by closing others out it won't help at all. If they refuse an offer, sure, it's their choice, but nothing they should have to suffer for in all eternity. If it happens often, then I can understand better why it will come to this.

When it comes to the other guilds that rarely join in or have officers/leaders online I get why they should be kicked, but Enclave still have great high ranked members online and really no reason to cut off all strings with them because of one or two incidents.

Svartsyn wrote:

Hmmm, seems things are getting worse than they should be...
In my eyes the main problem is the morale in general... Some people work to keep others up and when things don't pay off in any way it becomes quite draining... For example if people don't show up for certain things, when one tries to organize fun for alliance and people prefer leading/join pugs. Still no reason to overreact etc.

It is true that Equinox are strong at the moment, but not that strong... Imo we can't afford to lose any members, so be it alliance or guild members... Simply because a lot of things are resting on a very thin thread, including leaders/officers. Best possible solution would be to become one if possible.
Also I can't really see the point in doing this in a hostile way or with any hard feelings... And personally I don't want to lose Enclave. Why? Because Enclave were here long before me and I have nothing to say about it. The respect for the old members that I got to know in Enclave will remain and nothing should be done without consulting them first. No reason to get enemies for nothing.

So we have the greater numbers online, that doesn't make us any better as persons and saying we don't need them or whatever is quite disrespectful, cause after all we are mere players behind our monitors and we all want to have fun... Why close people out of that only because they can't pull good enough numbers etc? Their morale may be low as well and by closing others out it won't help at all. If they refuse an offer, sure, it's their choice, but nothing they should have to suffer for in all eternity. If it happens often, then I can understand better why it will come to this.

When it comes to the other guilds that rarely join in or have officers/leaders online I get why they should be kicked, but Enclave still have great high ranked members online and really no reason to cut off all strings with them because of one or two incidents.

Thank you for a good post Mika.
As one might understand from the original post enclave is somewhat outside this problem. As i stated they have members left and most important, they have leadership that wont give up easily.
I was in a meeting with massa and spanky earlier and we settled sunday 8pm uk time as our time for a weekly meeting. Nothing very advanced, just a get together for the leaders and officers to talk about whats been going on during the week and also discuss issues that might appear.
As for whitescars and santa i cannot see as of this moment how they can get something out from those meeting since thay have almost no members left, and from what i can tell, no leader willing to put a lot of effort to salvage their situation.

We should also remember that any posts in this thread is not representing the collective opinion about anything. Its the individual thoughts from the individual members. If someone has a special opinion about a certain matter i am most sure they have that opinion for a reason. And it needs to be considered. After all, all we are trying to do is to create an atmosphere and a forum for our players to play where they feel its worth the time and effort. No matter the direction. It is very painful for a leader or officer to meet the demands to satisfy every single individual in every possible way. But! What i am proud of is that we actually are managing VERY good at this right now. Everyone should have credit for that, no matter if its a leader, officer, player, hardcore or casual! Casuals have an understanding and respect for the hardcores. Hardcores have an understanding and respect for the casuals.
This of course goes for what i see in the equinox at the moment. I cant really speak for any of the other guilds. But ONE thing is more certain than ANYTHING ELSE: It makes me all warm and cozy to see that we all managed to cope with a serious situation we had a few weeks back. Many guilds have fallen apart totally but we all managed, with hard work, intense feelings, a huge amount of willpower and patience to get this train running again.

But dont let it rest here. Your willpower and sensation of companionship to your guild/alliance members is needed around the clock. In the end, it is always up to you as a member to create the very environment you want to exist in. Create something YOU know that YOU can take pride in. Something you have the right to brag about.

Alright first of all thank you Arch for pissing me off enough with your OP for me to actually go into getting enclave up with renewed vigor.
Secondly I'd just like to state that the whole people not joining alliance WB's is because of 1 reason only: The alliance WB was ventrilo mandatory now we are still a casual guild and we don't want to make vent mandatory to anyone, but if we want to keep our new members happy we do have to play with them so we decided to stay in a semi pug with about 8 guildies led by Rehlia as we cant afford to lose anyone because they dont feel like getting on vent.
Besides that a pug WB is a great place to recruit new members as you can see which people are good and can follow instructions of the WB leader and I think we all agree that enclave needs to have some new recruits.
So I'm sorry but we have to be a bit selfish in that now untill we got our guild sorted out a bit again.

Massa wrote:

Alright first of all thank you Arch for pissing me off enough with your OP for me to actually go into getting enclave up with renewed vigor.
Secondly I'd just like to state that the whole people not joining alliance WB's is because of 1 reason only: The alliance WB was ventrilo mandatory now we are still a casual guild and we don't want to make vent mandatory to anyone, but if we want to keep our new members happy we do have to play with them so we decided to stay in a semi pug with about 8 guildies led by Rehlia as we cant afford to lose anyone because they dont feel like getting on vent.
Besides that a pug WB is a great place to recruit new members as you can see which people are good and can follow instructions of the WB leader and I think we all agree that enclave needs to have some new recruits.
So I'm sorry but we have to be a bit selfish in that now untill we got our guild sorted out a bit again.

Hello there.
I'm not quite sure i get the very essence of your post Massa. Notthe first sentence at least
As for that very specific issue you adressed people found it weird that i was asked, out from the blue, to make a warband. Having done so i asked what the deal was about. Why were we in 2 different warbands? After 3 or maybe 4 attempts to ask about this in the alliance chat with no succes i just quit and left the 11 remaining members in the party just sitting there as big question marks.

And as for ventilo, as i have stated in the guidelines for the Equinox, its is strictly up to the former of the warband to adress if ventrilo is mandatory or not. It is not an alliance standard setting. Every WB leader makes his call for his group.

Anyways, i totally understand if you need to be selfish for a while. Actually i think that can help you focus on your problems and fix them faster. I have no problem at all to give you some space.
The very fact that you are participating actively in this gives me great comfort that Enclave will persist =)

Cheers

Archangelin wrote:

Massa wrote:

Alright first of all thank you Arch for pissing me off enough with your OP for me to actually go into getting enclave up with renewed vigor.

Hello there.
I'm not quite sure i get the very essence of your post Massa. Notthe first sentence at least

That was meant as something good since Massa is trying to make Enclave rise again!
We should give him and rest of Enclave our full support!

Archangelin wrote:

And as for ventilo, as i have stated in the guidelines for the Equinox, its is strictly up to the former of the warband to adress if ventrilo is mandatory or not. It is not an alliance standard setting. Every WB leader makes his call for his group.


Cheers

I agree with you there but then people don't have to start crap about other people not joining alliance WB's as they or some of their friends might not use vent and so don't want to join that WB.

Massa wrote:

Archangelin wrote:

And as for ventilo, as i have stated in the guidelines for the Equinox, its is strictly up to the former of the warband to adress if ventrilo is mandatory or not. It is not an alliance standard setting. Every WB leader makes his call for his group.


Cheers

I agree with you there but then people don't have to start crap about other people not joining alliance WB's as they or some of their friends might not use vent and so don't want to join that WB.

QFT

But also, even as no one can be forced to join alliance warband or forced to get on vent, it is still a wish we have that all will join since we are after all in an alliance. And of course it is a bit disappointing that people do not want to work more in-depth to make a difference (and also for a better community), when it is obvious how much vent helps to improve communication and ingame actions.
It's hard to meet between casual and more dedicated players and try to please all and at the same time work as a strong force and be better, faster and more strategical than our opponents. Those who have good communication will always have the upper hand. That is not something the group leaders have decided, but a fact we can see every day in the battlefields when close knit groups can take out greater numbers etc. But yeah, in the end voice communication is optional.

Anyway, with the suggested weekly ORvR event I hope things like these will work better, as there won't be such a demand for others to join in on the spontaneous activities and just adapt after whatever someone says, but instead focus on one day and give all one got at that time and work as a big team. Rest of the week I guess will be spontaneous things where one can join at will and do rvr casually or more "hardcore" if one wish. If vent will be mandatory or not will still be up to the leader of the group. If someone wants to join a group with vent requirements we will tell so and they can either join, go somewhere else or start another group up. But to ask people to join the warband as something they have to do and then demand they come on vent doesn't seem right to me... Still I do hope that those not used to and/or unwilling to use vent will realise what a powerful tool it is...
In either way, to have hectic things going on daily with a lot of musts and a without focus will be draining. For several reasons I think it is a good thing to have something weekly so each member (no matter gaming style/hair color/gender/race/blabla) will feel they contribute something, are a part of something bigger and feel important even if not having a hardcore gaming style and spend 24/7 on vent.

Dont feel an alliance is necessary tbh. They didnt want to help much when we wanted to make a wb for IC the other day and if we cant have guilds in an alliance cooperating then what is the point. Imo the focus should go on the guild and try to take a leaf out of moonlapses book. Good organised groups in rvr.

zaemon wrote:

Dont feel an alliance is necessary tbh. They didnt want to help much when we wanted to make a wb for IC the other day and if we cant have guilds in an alliance cooperating then what is the point. Imo the focus should go on the guild and try to take a leaf out of moonlapses book. Good organised groups in rvr.

^^^ this.

alliance guilds telling us to join their pugs, but never joining actual alliance warbands? using vent as an excuse?

to be honest, it's no wonder we're being rolled by order, no vent = less than 1/4 the coordination you'd get with it. without coordination we'll never win. simple.

be a casual guild if you like, but alliance groups should ALWAYS be a priority over pugs, ALWAYS. otherwise what the hell is the point of being in an alliance?

Zeamon and Bruglir I remember a time where things where the other way around Enclave was the big boy in the alliance and we tried alliance WB's running all the time.
Of course nobody of other guilds hardly ever showed up except for a few die hards so don't try and lecture me about the needs of alliance warbands or for that matter try and lecture the people of enclave how to run their guild.
If you people really feel your better off without us then leave with the attitude you are showing here I don't think we will lose a thing.